Omar
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Post by Omar on Oct 21, 2006 0:06:22 GMT
Steve Buscemi directed "Pine Barrens". Yeah, I listened to his audio commentary of the episode. If "Pine Barrens" is anything like one of his three films, then I can't wait to see them.
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Omar
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Post by Omar on Oct 26, 2006 4:05:31 GMT
Season four is very dark. You weren't kidding!!! Where do I start? Christopher slips further into drug addiction, Furio's depression and eventual departure, Adriana's entrapment as an FBI informant, Artie's attempted suicide, Gloria's actual suicide, the death of Bobby's wife........and then of course there's Ralph. The whole episode of "Whoever Did This" was completely mesmerizing. It rivals "Pine Barrens" as my favorite. In some strange way, it reminded me of "In the Bedroom". Joe Pantoliano gave the performance of the series in this episode, and I was sad to see him go. It was interesting how the episode starts out with his son's accident, and then Ralph seeking redemption, and then BAM, the episode takes a left turn and Tony brutally murders Ralph. In vengeance of Pie-Oh-My or maybe Tracee, Raphie's mistress in Season 3 who he murdered? It was also interesting how the writers tried to make Ralph appear as the devil by having a few of his lines in this episode direct quotes from The Rolling Stones' "Sympathy for the Devil". The episode revealed a lot about Tony, and I liked how the second half of the episode was mainly about him and Christopher disposing Ralph's body. A very surreal episode. The season finale was an interesting one too. I was expecting either Paulie, Johnny Sack, or Carmine to get whacked by the end of the season. Instead, Carmela wants a separation from Tony, thanks to that whore Irina, who every-time I think has left the show, somehow ends up appearing again. Interesting way to end things this season. What are everyone else's thoughts on Season 4? And while I'm asking questions, does anyone know why they skipped a year between Season 4 and Season 5?
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Capo
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Post by Capo on Oct 26, 2006 4:24:19 GMT
The opening episode of season four was, when I first watched it, my least favourite of the entire show. It seemed so inconsistent, so overly dark without any justification. And on the whole, despite some outstanding episodes such as "The Weight", "Whoever Did This" and "Whitecaps", I used to think it was the beginning of the end. I've revisited it since, and love it. It's a very sophisticated season, and Chase further exploring the notion of having thirteen mini-films comprise an entire season. I love the episode in which Artie gets in debt with the French guy. It's such a great exploration, I think, of masculinity, something which becomes even more prominent in season six.
As for season five, it reaches many highs up there with anything Chase has produced on the show. The acting is sublime, and the opening potential and tensions created by the new faces (Steve Buscemi being one of them) is very interesting.
Omar, have your thoughts on Silvio changed at all? He is my favourite character in the show, after Tony. I've always liked the loyal consiglieri (Hagen in The Godfather etc.), and I always feel like Tony's in control when Silvio's in the room with him. For the most part, though, he is underused.
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Omar
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Post by Omar on Oct 26, 2006 4:44:29 GMT
Omar, have your thoughts on Silvio changed at all? He is my favorite character in the show, after Tony. I've always liked the loyal consiglieri (Hagen in The Godfather etc.), and I always feel like Tony's in control when Silvio's in the room with him. For the most part, though, he is underused. Yes, they have. In fact, they started changing in Season 3, mainly with the episode "University". I loved the scene where he goes to get Tracee from Ralph's place. It's as if we finally got to see him be his character on the show, away from Tony and everything else. I'm liking him a little more these days. And I forgot to mention that I enjoyed seeing Peter Bogdanovich's character out of the office and interacting with other characters on the show, and his potential confrontation with Tony and the parking garage. I'm not sure if he'll play a big part in the rest of the show, but I like his character a lot.
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Boz
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Post by Boz on Oct 26, 2006 9:34:17 GMT
My general thoughts on Season 4, although it's been a while.
A season that starts off, as Capo seemed to say, dark for the sake of being dark. While the first few episodes are uneventful, unfocused, and uninteresting, the introduction of Ralph as a major character and a driving force for all the other's actions, somewhere after the midpoint of the season, breathes new life into the remaining episodes. From the moment his son is hit with arrow, we're sent on a tumultuous dive downwards towards violence and betrayals (not these things are uncommon to the show in general, mind you), a vicious cycle that ends with Ralph's death at the hands of Tony. I have always, always, loved the systematic, unemotional dismembering and disposal of Ralph's body. It does have a very surreal quality, like you said Omar, but it's also a great stage for some chemistry and comradarie between Tony and Chris.
While the season ender, Whitecaps, is somewhat of a return to humor with the storyline involving the real estate agent, but also one of the more pivotal episodes of the series from that point on considering it contains the sudden emergence of the separation storyline (that unfortunately dragged out for much of the next season), I found it a mediocre capper to a mediocre season. Not the best the Sopranos has to offer (eager to hear your reactions on Season 5), but it's still better than most of what's on TV. I might be doing my Sopranos marathon earlier than expected now.
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Omar
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Post by Omar on Nov 2, 2006 5:01:58 GMT
I am so devestated........depressed.......Adriana........ I hate having a roommate. I'm going to take a shower and cry.
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Post by Valenti on Nov 2, 2006 8:06:52 GMT
I am so devestated........depressed.......Adriana........ I hate having a roommate. I'm going to take a shower and cry. You had to have seen it coming... Still depressing, though.
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Capo
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Post by Capo on Nov 2, 2006 13:59:01 GMT
I am so devestated........depressed.......Adriana........ I hate having a roommate. I'm going to take a shower and cry. Does that mean your roommate told you about it, or that you've watched it and don't want to cry in his presence? What did you think of season five?
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Omar
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Post by Omar on Nov 2, 2006 18:45:17 GMT
Does that mean your roommate told you about it, or that you've watched it and don't want to cry in his presence? The latter. But in regards to Season 5, it is my favorite of the series, and I'll try to condense my thoughts a little, and get them organized. I thought the season started out stronger than ever, with the emergence of several interesting characters: Feech La Mann, Tony B., and Phil. The whole power struggle in New York was an interesting storyline. I was sad to see Feech's character leave the show so early, but the moments that he was in were very memorable. Phil wasn't given that much to do this season, but he was also memorable despite limited moments. Tony B. was a great addition to the show, and provided Tony (Uncle John) with some interesting psychological problems this season. Tony (Uncle John)'s guilt about having the panic attack many years before, and thus promoting Tony B. and neglecting the fact that he was a loose cannon all along was great. Plus, Steve Buscemi on "The Sopranos" is gold, either behind or in front of the camera. Even though the separation continued throughout most of the season, I think it was a nice change of pace. Plus, Tony wasn't in therapy that much this season, which provided more time to witness other things. I'm glad Artie and Tony made up, too. But ultimately I'm glad he and Carmela got back together. Tony's long trek home through the snow in the season finale "All Due Respect" was symbolic, in a way. Speaking of Carmela, I'm glad she got to venture out of her shell and have sexual relations with someone else. Mr. Wegler, though he was only in three episodes, was a nice addition to the show, giving us another view of Carmela. Plus, David Strathairn is very underrated. Now, two episodes that struck me in very different ways: The Test DreamThis beats "Pine Barrens" as my favorite episode. Bizarre and very well done, this episode provided the series' most surreal and humorous moments. Artie instructing Tony on how to fuck his wife, among other things, was brilliant. Some of my favorite lines: Tony: "You're Annette Bening.......I knew it!" ;D Gloria: "Annette Bening?" Annette Bening: "There's something Bugsy about him!" Tony: "Hey douche bag, I know I'm dreaming!" Mickey Palmice: "I don't have an opinion, one way or another." And Vin singing Lionel Richie was priceless. I was shocked to see Mickey Palmice, and a nearly unrecognizable Richie Aprile. Long Term ParkingIn response to an earlier statement, yes, I did have to realize that she was gonna get it. But the way it was done....it just broke my heart. Hiding the fact that Tony knew during his phone-call was a stroke of genius. The minute Adriana stopped daydreaming and was in the car with Silvio, my heart sank. I knew it was going down. The way he dragged her out of the car...the dread... The scene where she confesses to Christopher was sad, but reminded a lot of the scene in "Goodfellas" where Henry realizes that Karen flushed all of his drugs down the toilet. Anyway, years ago, before I was interested in "The Sopranos", Steve Van Zandt was on "The Jay Leno", and they showed the clip of Silvio in the car with Adriana. I remembered the clip, but I always thought it was Meadow. It's kind of strange, in retrospect, realizing that he was about to kill her... Anyway, I've talked to long. I still don't feel that show improves with each season. Maybe I will when I revisit them. But for now, this is the order I rank them in from my favorite to least favorite: Season 5 Season 3 Season 2 (I loved the character of Richie Aprile) Season 4 (A mixed bag; very uneven after Ralph died) Season 1 (Good, but no where near as great as the others) And by the way, I knew Vito was gay. At least, I knew someone was gay from a joke Conan O'Brien made at the Emmy's. And that clip on the first page of this thread kind of spelled it out for me. Still, I wasn't expecting to find out in that episode, so it was a surprise, in that aspect.
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Boz
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Post by Boz on Nov 2, 2006 22:56:34 GMT
My personal rankings.
1. Season 3 2. Season 1 3. Season 5 4. Season 4/Season 2 6. Season 6 (needs a rewatch before I feel too strongly about it).
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Omar
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Post by Omar on Nov 3, 2006 0:33:02 GMT
Any thoughts on Season 5 in particular?
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Capo
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Post by Capo on Nov 3, 2006 1:15:53 GMT
Season five or season three is my favourite, but I'm dying to revisit season four. Five has many fantastic, fantastic moments, and again, individual episodes are used to further characters, not story. The one that springs to mind is the incredibly intense (both sexually and as regards violence) episode in which Tony and Adriana almost get it on. It's also responsible for the hilarious succession of rumours about the two after they crash, which of course culminates in Junior saying, "He came all over the windscreen!" (Or something like that!) I love the tension between Tony and Phil, something which develops further in season six... the scene in which Tony, in his new white jeep, chases down Phil in his car, reminds me of the badass Tony which beat up Mikey Palmice with a wall stapler in season one. There's something very fitting in snow in The Sopranos. Whether or not it's a coincidence that "Pine Barrens" is my favourite episode and the finale of season five is my favourite season-ender, I don't know, but I love the way the ultra-crisp cinematography captures the white. There's something aesthetically gorgeous in the way Tony's breath is visible right after he shoots Tony B. Something rugged, and even humane about it. Something incredibly credible; I don't know. ...and also very funny: Johnny Sac's fall in the snow when the Feds come to get him is absolutely priceless. And on that note, I think Vincent Curatola, besides Gandolfini and Falco, is the best actor on the show. He steals almost any scene he's in, and is the only guy who stands up to Tony without seeming a caricature or wannabe. I love the scene in the rain, with him and Tony in the hearse at Billy Leotardo's funeral. Omar, did you notice that the season begins with a bear entering the back garden, and ends with Tony entering the back garden? I think that's what you may have meant by the symbolism, but I'm not sure. Glad you liked it. "The Test Dream" is also one of my favourite episodes too.
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Omar
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Post by Omar on Nov 3, 2006 3:21:44 GMT
Yeah, the whole episode of "Irregular Around the Margins" was an interesting one. It showed how gossip could escalate into deadly measures, much like in Season 1 with Uncle Junior eating pussy and Tony seeing a psychiatrist. Tony was so close to killing Christopher, but Tony B. saved his life, and he never really grasped that.
And the car chase between Tony and Phil, with The Clash's "Rockin' the Casbah" playing the background was great. I look forward to seeing more of Phil in season 6.
I never realized that Tony's breath was visible after he kills Tony B. It's as if he could finally breath again after years of guilt and being burdened by a cousin who he kept reminding everybody he loved sooo much were finally over. And I agree, snow on "The Sopranos" is special. I think that's why I now prefer Season 3 over Season 2.
I think the symbolism I was looking for had to do with the fact that Tony was working his way back to Carmela all season, and after the long trek through the snow, he is greeted and welcomed inside his home. He has returned. It's a big contrast to the opening of the season, with the house looking in disrepair, and Meadow running over Tony's newspaper. But the bear comparison just about blew my mind.
And once again about "The Test Dream"; it's great to see the dead return briefly, but just think how far the show has come since they've been gone.
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Omar
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Post by Omar on Nov 10, 2006 19:28:21 GMT
I don't usually like to comment before I've watched a whole season, but "Mayham" has one of the funniest scenes ever in the whole series. The whole 'Saw meets The Godfather' movie pitch scene was great.
Vito: "So he's a ghost? I don't get it!" Christopher: "Ghostbusters! Another fuckin money machine!"
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Omar
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Post by Omar on Nov 19, 2006 22:57:10 GMT
I finished Season Six yesterday, and liked it for the most part. Not my favorite season, but not my least favorite either.
It would be easy to rate this season badly and declare it a departure from the series, and the introduction of "The Sopranos" as a soap opera. You have Tony's coma, Vito's sexual odyssey, Johnny Sac's breakdown as his daughter's wedding, etc. But I don't think this season was a letdown at all.
The first three episodes were amazing. It was scary seeing a toothless and deranged Uncle Junior in "Members Only". "Join the Club" and "Mayham" felt like Twilight Zone episodes, with James Gandolfini speaking in his real voice, making the alternative reality a whole lot stranger.
And then there is Vito. You can't mention Season 6 without thinking of Mr. Spatafore. Upon watching it, I'm not sure that all of that was necessary, but really, I'm not sure how I would have handled Vito's story. I do know that he had to die. The show wouldn't have worked otherwise. Either way, the story of Vito is a sad one. The scene where he talks to his son on the telephone while he is in hiding is heartbreaking, as is the scene where his children read the paper and learn the truth about their father.
Carmela's trip to Paris was interesting, as was her obsession to find Adriana. The Paris dream sequence with Adriana had to have been a reference to "Papillon", but the whole trip and Carm's philosophical musings were interesting.
I noticed too that this season seemed far more political than any others. Not just with Vito's homosexuality, but there were also many references to Hurricane Katrina, and David Chase's vision of Little Carmine as George W. Bush. Interesting.
Any thoughts on Season Six?
~~~~~~~~~~~
Now, what can we expect for the final eight next year? I've read some pretty outrageous rumors, one being that AJ and Meadow get drunk and have sex, infuriating Tony so much that he kills them. I've also read that Christopher will be HIV positive.
So far though, the most plausible sounding predictions are that Christopher and Tony will have a falling out due to the real estate agent that they both had an affair with. This might sound ridiculous, but don't forget that Tony almost got killed in Season One for seeing a psychiatrist and making fun of Uncle Junior's love of eating out.
I've also read that some pictures are on-line of a bald Johnny Sac out of prison and standing outside of a church. The rumor goes that Johnny is suffering from cancer, and in the picture is attending Christopher's son's baptism.
All rumors at this point, but what does everyone else think we can look forward to in 2007?
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Capo
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Post by Capo on Nov 20, 2006 5:23:03 GMT
Posted earlier in this thread when I saw season six:
There is a moment in the penultimate episode of this twelve-part series, wherein Silvio tells Tony, upon hearing of a Capo's death, "This isn't about Vito, this is about you". It is a subtle nod to the form of the season as a whole; the plots dealing with other characters throughout are dealt with only in relation to Tony, and how he reacts to them. Vito's homosexuality may frustrate some, but it certainly allows Chase and co. to expose the mentality behind the Mob. If it is more fragmented (episodic?) than previous seasons, and falls further into inconclusive, inconsistent narrative threads, then it also probes deeper into psychological boundaries and proves insightful of characters, most of whom are revised here to have sides to them the previous five seasons fail to show. The seasons have become more and more mature and slower-paced as the show has progressed, and here the tone is heavily reflective, with characters all in some kind of identity crisis: Paulie finds out he isn't the man he thought he was, Christopher spirals back onto drugs, Carmela philosophises in Paris, and Tony dreams of being Kevin Finnerty whilst in a coma, to mention just a few. The show has developed into a darker, more existential series than some may have liked; its self-reflexivity and increasing intertextuality mark it as a highly clever turn, less about the Mafia than questions of identity, and masculinity in particular. Tellingly, early on in the season, Tony awakens from his coma and mutters, "Who am I? Where am I going?" It could just as easily have been Chase questioning who these creations are, and what is expected of them.
I think season six is destined to be highly misunderstood, and as a result underrated. I'd like to find time to revisit the other five seasons some time soon, but I doubt I will. For some reason, I am leaning towards season four, which I always felt both underwhelmed me in spots but contained some of the best moments the makers were responsible for. I think gut instinct makes season three or five the best.
I really am not one for predicting what happens with this show.
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Omar
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Post by Omar on Mar 22, 2007 20:15:40 GMT
WARNING: VIDEO MIGHT CONTAIN SPOILERS (while it's the standard preview set up before the season, it could offend some who wish to know absolutely nothing about the new season) video.msn.com/v/us/fv/fv.htm??g=5fd9d589-04a9-4ff7-a5eb-0fb568fee7fb&f=01/64&fg=copyI'm just about crying due to the anticipation. I've read way too much about this upcoming season. I hope the predictions I have read turn out not to be true, and that the show still surprises the hell out of me. I've heard the first episode of the final nine is incredible. One reviewer compared it to "Who's Afraid of Virginia Woolf?" I can't fucking wait.
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Capo
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Post by Capo on Mar 22, 2007 20:58:58 GMT
"Carmine, you gotta step up."
Isn't it common knowledge the guy's a retard?
I can't wait. I really can't.
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Omar
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Post by Omar on Mar 22, 2007 21:40:48 GMT
I wonder what Tony did now to make Carmella so mad. Maybe due to the arrest, which looks local instead of federal.
And I wonder what Christopher did to make Carmella so disappointed in him??? Either way, looks like Junior is getting some action.
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Capo
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Post by Capo on Mar 22, 2007 21:49:19 GMT
The way they've edited it together makes it look like Chrissy's film deal has gone through, and the film in some way indicts Tony or something. I love their trailers though; they're probably the most mis-leading, well-assembled trailers on TV, in that they show so much and yet, because of the lack of context, show so little.
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