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Post by Michael on Jul 6, 2006 16:53:29 GMT
A racist film is very interesting to me.
And innovation/influence doesn't hold much ground with me. I base my ratings on emotional responses, and innovation is something that exists outside of the actual film. If I wasn't aware of Citizen Kane's innovation or influence, I'd still love it the same, regardless.
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Post by Vercetti on Jul 6, 2006 17:10:43 GMT
Well then this where there's a differ.
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RNL
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Post by RNL on Jul 6, 2006 17:41:25 GMT
Wetdog, I'm talking about myself only. I don't care if other people appreciate the form and composition of films as opposed to stories and characters, and I'm not going to judge them for it. Like I said, everybody is different. Fine, but "oooh look how purdy" were the words you chose to describe those values. Just know it's not a glassy-eyed, drooling daze I'm talking about. Okay, then didn't you find Boogie Nights formally interesting? I would think that if you were as disinterested in the subject matter of the story as you've stated, that it'd be a relief to direct some attention to the form instead. It's strange that you like Godard, since he's the quintessential formalist filmmaker. His films are all about how images and sounds, and often text, can be put together. depth being some sort of meaning or message. Could you give me an example of a message you find deep? Because for me, it's absolutely the last thing I want to see in a film. Meanings in general I'm of two minds about, but that's a can of worms.
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Post by Michael on Jul 6, 2006 18:08:18 GMT
Okay, then didn't you find Boogie Nights formally interesting? I would think that if you were as disinterested in the subject matter of the story as you've stated, that it'd be a relief to direct some attention to the form instead. Nope. A few moments here or there wasn't going to save the film from being a total disaster. Godard? I've seen a mere 3 films from him, 2 being masterpieces, one that is very good. Again, I base my ratings on emotional responses only, and I found Godard's films, although mostly unsubtle, to be very provocative. Messages, or meanings, are completely lucid. I feel cinema is a form of communication as well as art, and the viewer can find whatever meaning he or she wants from a film. With that said, I don't find any particular messages in cinema anymore, and don't want to. I approach cinema as an interaction between viewer and filmmaker, which is why I adore Robert Bresson's style of filmmaking. Provocative is the word for me. Any film that stimulates thought or strikes an emotional chord with me is a masterpiece.
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RNL
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Post by RNL on Jul 6, 2006 19:48:06 GMT
You're quite right that meanings and messages are lucid, detached and not about the experience of the film. They could be communicated fully from one person to another without either having ever seen the film. This is one of the reasons why I'm of two minds about meanings of all kinds in art.
But now I'm confused, because one page ago you said:
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Jenson71
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Post by Jenson71 on Jul 6, 2006 20:07:50 GMT
Hey, Wet Dog, according to many people, Casablanca is one of the greatest films ever made. And I think supporters of the film would argue it's greatness is due to its "substance". I personally don't think there's anything to out of the ordinary about the camera work in the film, but I don't have the greatest eye when it comes to that stuff yet. Wet Dog, what's your take on Casablanca?
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Post by Michael on Jul 6, 2006 21:03:48 GMT
But now I'm confused, because one page ago you said: Where did I say anything about messages in the second quote? By meaning I meant more along the lines of meaningful to me, or in other words, like I've said 438975423 times already, the film deals with themes that I find provocative and intriguing.
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Post by The Ghost of LLC on Jul 6, 2006 22:12:26 GMT
The Squid and the Whale (2005) - Director: Noah Baumbach Set in a 1980s-Brooklyn, a high school under-grad and his younger brother are left in the stressful situation of joint-custody when their parents finally decide to give in and divorce.Here's a movie that struck close to home. Having expirienced my own parents divorce, I found myself being able to relate to this film completely. Baumbach captures not only the stress of joint-custody, but also the humor. While divorce is a stressing and a depressing expirience, I also found humor in the entire idea as a child. The film captures that humor... the confusion, and everything that follows. I can relate exact scenes in this film to my own expiriences--IE, children picking "sides" with one parent or the other. In adition, I enjoyed Baumbach's use of music. I was estatic to find that the film features my favorite Lou Reed song, "Street Hassle" as well as Pink Floyd's "Hey You".
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RNL
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Post by RNL on Jul 7, 2006 1:43:28 GMT
But now I'm confused, because one page ago you said: Where did I say anything about messages in the second quote? By meaning I meant more along the lines of meaningful to me, or in other words, like I've said 438975423 times already, the film deals with themes that I find provocative and intriguing. Yeah, okay, but when you say 'meaningful' do you mean in the way that words have meanings, or do you mean more of an 'emotional resonance' in the way that a piece of music might be 'meaningful' (though I think this usage is probably a dead metaphor of some kind)? It's just, I'm not sure if you want the film's form to somehow further expand its exploration of those provocative and interesting themes, and thereby carry 'meaning' in the way that words do, or if you want those provocative and interesting themes present and framed by a form that you find emotionally resonant apart from those themes? Ironically, 'meaning' has a troublesome double meaning. Vercetti brought up the tracking zoom from Vertigo as an example of a shot that carries no meaning in the first sense of the word but carries plenty of the second. I actually think, though, it's a perfect example of the film's form being used precisely to service the themes and characterisation, because what that shot 'means', quite literally, is 'vertigo'.
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RNL
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Post by RNL on Jul 7, 2006 1:44:14 GMT
Hey, Wet Dog, according to many people, Casablanca is one of the greatest films ever made. And I think supporters of the film would argue it's greatness is due to its "substance". I personally don't think there's anything to out of the ordinary about the camera work in the film, but I don't have the greatest eye when it comes to that stuff yet. Wet Dog, what's your take on Casablanca? Not a personal favourite of mine, but I think it's very good.
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Post by The Ghost of LLC on Jul 7, 2006 3:43:24 GMT
Eyes Wide Shut (1999) - Director: Stanley Kubrick After having his wife confess to nearly committing adultry, a Manhattan doctor is pushed along a night of sex and discovery....Wow. This is still sinking in. What an amazing note for Kubrick to close his career on; I have to admit to being alarmed and worried that at this point, the man may have lost his touch, but he certainly did not. Sure, this may not measure at the same mark as previous achievements such as A Clockwork Orange or 2001: A Space Odyssey, but it is no less than a momentous achievement. His direction is absolutely flawless. He managed to work out of his actors some of the best I've seen from them. The story and cinematography had me on edge throughout, and the erie piano score only pushed this reaction further. This is a film I am going to continue to take time to ponder, and process on a deeper, perhaps philosophical stand point. And yes. It is like softcore porn with better acting.
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Post by Michael on Jul 7, 2006 4:14:18 GMT
Eyes Wide ShutToo lazy for a proview now...but I agree with everything Giorgio said, except that it wasn't on the level of 2001 or Clockwork...I actually feel this is Kubrick's best film.
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Omar
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Post by Omar on Jul 7, 2006 4:39:31 GMT
and the erie piano score only pushed this reaction further. I remember that the most. Very unnerving, especially when Cruise returns back to the house and is met at the gates. Very creepy film.
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Post by Vercetti on Jul 7, 2006 4:47:22 GMT
It's odd. I downloaded Eyes Wide Shut months ago and forgot about it.
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Post by The Ghost of LLC on Jul 7, 2006 18:56:20 GMT
and the erie piano score only pushed this reaction further. I remember that the most. Very unnerving, especially when Cruise returns back to the house and is met at the gates. Very creepy film. Yes. That was the creepiest orgy I've ever seen, and God knows I'm a regular swinger. I attend orgies all the time with my old Oxford buddies. I'm into feet. And skulls.
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Post by Mike Sullivan on Jul 7, 2006 19:33:21 GMT
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Post by Michael on Jul 11, 2006 4:06:47 GMT
MagnoliaThis is a great film. Anderson creates an amazing character study of a multitude of characters, and manages to flawlessly develop and intertwine each's story. The music fits perfectly within the film, and gives it a more haunting feel. Overall, the best thing about this film is the performance of Tom Cruise. Not only do I believe this was Cruise's best performance, but one of the best performances I've ever seen, period.
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jrod
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Post by jrod on Jul 11, 2006 5:19:06 GMT
Havent really been here for awhile. Heres a couple recent viewings End Game ZERO 1st Viewing I watched this movie bc it was shot at my school. Met James Woods and Cuba Gooding Jr. The movie was extremely bad however...was like a really really bad John Woo or Michael Bay action flick. And I really hate all the movies Ive seen by both THOSE guys. Sabetour Ist Viewing A somewhat flawed but very good Hitchcock film. An "innocent victim" movie a step behind North by Northwest and 39 Steps, but probably a little better then both Man Who Knew Too Much movies (damn, Hitch made a lot of movies of that sort) Resident Evil ZERO 1st Viewing Shit 25th Hour 1st Viewing I havent seen much Spike Lee, but Ive liked almost all that I have. This movie was pretty good most of the way through, didnt think the ending did it justice however. Great cast gave great performances Shadow of a Doubt 2nd Viewing One of the best Hitchcocks. I wish he and Joseph Cotten wouldve collaborated more Rope 2nd Viewing Another Hitchcock that I think is really good. Jimmy Stewart gives a different performance then Im used to from him, and Im still suprised that the extremely homosexual undertones between the main characters got into a movie made back then
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Capo
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Post by Capo on Jul 11, 2006 10:08:09 GMT
I think Rope is one Hitch's most underrated films.
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Post by The Ghost of LLC on Jul 11, 2006 20:11:09 GMT
25th Hour 1st Viewing didnt think the ending did it justice however. Really? I thought the ending was quite powerful. Although, I have a feeling many non-New Yorkers get confused, and assume that they end up fleeing... But the last shot is a shot of them driving past the entrance to the bridge, so... But, I think that Norton's "Fuck You" speech and the end speech are two of the most powerful speechs I've seen in any recent films.
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